» Wednesday, September 8, 2004

Fox Hunting

Asked if an announcement on fox hunting would be made today, the PMOS said that as the Prime Minister had told journalists in his press conference yesterday, Parliament would be the first to be informed about any announcement on fox hunting. Asked repeatedly if a Parliamentary Question (PQ) by Paddy Tipping MP asking whether the Secretary of State for DEFRA would make a statement on fox hunting would be answered today, the PMOS said that the usual Parliamentary procedures would apply, as you would expect. Asked what was so difficult about confirming whether the PQ would be answered today or not, the PMOS said that any Parliamentary Question which was tabled would obviously be answered in the normal way. It wasn’t our practice to brief on every single one that came along. Asked to confirm suggestions that the PQ had been tabled solely to put pressure on DEFRA, the PMOS said that he wasn’t aware of such reports. He repeated that the PQ would be answered in the normal way. Asked how long it would take, the PMOS said that we tried to answer PQs as quickly as possible. Put to him that it sometimes took Departments weeks to reply, the PMOS said he did not think that was normally the case.

Asked if the Prime Minister would take the opportunity to express again his personal view on fox hunting, the PMOS said that he was not aware of any plans for him to do so at this stage. Asked to remind journalists what his views were, the PMOS said that they were on the record and could be easily found through Google.

Briefing took place at 11:00 | Search for related news

39 Comments »

  1. Fox hunting must be banned. It is so evil and wrong. How can it be a event killing inocient foxs. I think if that is some peoples idea of fun , maybe they need to have different ideas of how to have fun with out hurting something.

    Comment by Gemma Clarke — 19 Sep 2004 on 12:25 pm | Link
  2. I have seen lambs slaughtered across the fields by ‘innocent’ foxes, i have seen chickens without heads because of ‘innocent’ foxes and I have seen cats left to die because of ‘innocent’ foxes, not so innocent now are they? I have also seen foxes left half dead by bullets shot from long distances by farmers at night and this just all goes to prove how much more humanee hunting is, the fox dies instantly, that’s if it gets caught. You can not blame a farmer for wanting to protect his livlihood. I am sixteen years old and people look at me with disgust when I say i hunt, but I am proud I do it, it is a tradition and a way of life. They think that because i am young i don’t understand what i am doing but I understand better than they do for not one anti-hunt person that I have ever met has known the facts of the sport and this is what annoys me. Not everyone living in the countryside agrees with it but fair enough, however the majority do, so leave the countryside to deal with the countryside issues and get on with your own lives, for i bet half of you against our sport wear leather shoes and eat chicken sandwiches therefore you can’t judge us until you judge yourselves. SAVE OUR SPORT, i say.

    Comment by ella — 21 Oct 2004 on 10:06 am | Link
  3. Children under 16 say that even after the ban is imposed, they will carry on hunting, even if it means prison. Surely this emphasises how strongly we feel about our tradition.I have hunted since I was ten years old and generations before me have too, it is an old tradition in our family, one that I refuse to let die.

    Comment by Louise — 5 Nov 2004 on 11:19 am | Link
  4. It doesn’t matter how many generations of your family have killed animals for fun, it is still wrong and should be banned.

    Comment by Uncarved Block — 6 Nov 2004 on 8:27 pm | Link
  5. sorry to have to disagree with you there, but speaking as someone who doesnt really care about hunting, id have to say leave it be!
    id say there is more to loose by banning it then there is to gain after being ot a hunt stables and finding out more about it
    if as much was thought about people as seems to be about foxes then i probably wouldnt mind, but until i hear the same amount of outrage at killing people as there is about a few foxes (which are vermin) ill be with the pro hunting lot, as unpopular as that may be…….

    Comment by tony — 7 Nov 2004 on 12:53 am | Link
  6. Sorry to all those pro-hunting people. The majority of people in this country (and in the countryside) want fox-hunting with dogs banned. We elected a government with a pledge to ban such hunting on their election manifesto. We have been patient and waited a long time for this ban. There have been lots of other serious priorities and issues so this wasn’t our number one priority over the last years. That said, previous attempts to pass legislation were bounced back from the House of Lords. Enough is enough.

    Fox-hunting is not the most effective way of getting rid of foxes that are pests, nor that which is most widely used for this. (Of course it depends on the locality, but it means that those communities which use fox-hunting will have to adapt to other methods). Sorry about losing your "traditions", but like "your" previous traditions of cock-fighting, dog-fighting, bear-baiting, etc. the majority of people find fox-hunting (with dogs) unacceptable. Some traditions do die out, either naturally or like this. You will have to start some new ones. Most of us feel you could take up something like drag-hunting.

    Comment by bryan — 7 Nov 2004 on 9:31 am | Link
  7. Personally I didnt elect a Government on the issue of banning hunting, in fact it was more on the education promises and as they have not delivered on that, why should they on this. The main point I was making, is that if the amount of noise made about this issue from both sides was put to more important issues, then this country would be a better place.

    Comment by tony — 7 Nov 2004 on 2:24 pm | Link
  8. If anyone agrees with the killing of foxes, are wrong. Apparently they must be at the back, or stop, because they never see the carnage a dog can do. Or live in a fantisy land where everything is fine. When its not. I’ve seen pictures where dogs are litterally tearing the innocent fox to bits, or the remains of the fox. Some of them have their eyes pooping out. Like the cartoons. Like where the coyoty gets ran over, or realizes he is about to fall off the cliff. Except the fact be told. This is real life. They are pretatory animals. Of course they will kill! Just like any pretatory animal. If people are supporting the hunt, you may think I’m taking this out of context, but people open your eyes! But we might as well kill all the mink, they to kill chickens, and other winged animals, mice, rabbits, ect. What about wolves and wild cats? Wolves constantly kill livestock, and animals, so do wild cats, and yet you don’t see people on horse back to go after these animals with dogs. What about bears? They kill people every year, and kill animals. Pretatory animals do what they do best, hunt and kill. They can’t stop them selves from killing innocent animals. They do what they have to do to survive. What about all the kits the female fox leaves behind, newly born, defenseless,kits and end up starving to death, dieing. Normally a human will be thrown in jail if an animal is staved to death on purpose. But hunters get away with killing the female and her babies is wrong. THERE ARE OTHER WAYS THAN TO HUNT DOWN A FOX WITH DOGS AND HORSES!!!! Like tapping them in humane traps and than euthanising them. This may take time and money. But its better than letting dogs catch, and CRUELY dispose of the fox. But the question always remains. What will happen to all the hunting dogs? Easy. The hunts can continue as long as there are NO FOXES INVOLVED!!! Sure animals may be killed, but look at all the animals they do eat. Moles, insects that could cause problems to people with harvest stocks, and other not so good animals including the rabbit, and other small animals. Like mice. You must take the good with the bad. But if we were not to take anything with the bad, than we might as well as kill everything. Because not everything is good. I’m strickly against the hunting. I believe there are other ways to solving the fox problem, other than this senceless killing, masacre of the poor foxes. Have an doubets? E-mail me at horsegirl@msn.com (this e-mail may or may not work, it always does something funny, and I don’t get any mail, if not, post your question and I’ll find that website and post it, so you can see for your self what foxs go through!) and I’ll show you what I am taking about! And if it was my choice I’d ban fox hunting in a heart beat! ALSO I DARE ANYONE TO CHALLANGE MY OPINION! I LOVE CHALLANGES AND I WILL MEET THEM! JUST POST THEM! KILLING ANIMALS IN THE NAME OF FUN IS WRONG! IT HAS TO STOP NOW! AND HUNTING STABLES CAN BE TURNED INTO EVENT STABLES! AND THE HUNTING DOGS BE TURNED INTO AGILITY DOGS! Things can be different, not one way or another, black and white, things can change. They always don’t have to remain, but change and die out. Its a way a life. Things change. This was posted at 9:00 pm PST

    Comment by Kate — 21 Nov 2004 on 4:59 am | Link
  9. Hunting stables can not be turned into event stables for we have one and the horse here will not event, they do not like show jumping and don’t do dressage, hence the reason they are hunt horses, many of them have been through many proffessions in their lives and hunting is the last resort. Hunting never catches the healthy foxes anyway and trapping is no way more humane than hunting, foxes bite their own limbs off to get out of the traps and die of starvation or bloodloss so check your facts. And banning foxhunting will mean the murder of over three thousand dogs cos what can they do after hunting, nothing! This could devastate thousands and i am one of them.

    Comment by ellie — 24 Nov 2004 on 3:49 pm | Link
  10. Hunting stables can not be turned into event stables for we have one and the horse here will not event, they do not like show jumping and don’t do dressage, hence the reason they are hunt horses, many of them have been through many proffessions in their lives and hunting is the last resort. Hunting never catches the healthy foxes anyway and trapping is no way more humane than hunting, foxes bite their own limbs off to get out of the traps and die of starvation or bloodloss so check your facts. And banning foxhunting will mean the murder of over three thousand dogs cos what can they do after hunting, nothing! This could devastate thousands and i am one of them.

    Comment by ellie — 24 Nov 2004 on 3:49 pm | Link
  11. i think that fox hunting is totally wrong and people who do it should get riped apart by dogs them selves and see how fun that is for them and the people who do it are mainly stupid little spoilt brats and make me completely sick i hate the way they think watchin a innocent little fox being riped apart is fun and a sport all they do is sit on a horse why dont they find areally sport like ice hockey but i bet they would be to scared they would brake a nail

    Comment by stacey — 17 Feb 2005 on 7:05 pm | Link
  12. foxes only attack other animals to survie so dont give that shit that killing them for fun is acceptable your dogs get feed so do you and your horse so why do you have to chase a fox and watch it be riped apart in so much pain when a fox eats a sheep it is only lookin for food to live other wise it would not need to i would love to watch a gang of foxes come and chase you and kill you for no reason but for fun

    Comment by stacey — 17 Feb 2005 on 7:12 pm | Link
  13. All this fuss about fox hunting is ridiculous. Make a fuss about the 100,000 Blair/Bush are thought to have killed in Iraq and the 500,000 kids that died during the sanctions period against Saddam if you/ve got nothing better to do.

    The Labour left would rather hit out at a country pursuit, supposedly 100% upper class (not) than face down Blair. What a trade-off! What a load of toss pots.

    Comment by Mr Pooter — 17 Feb 2005 on 7:17 pm | Link
  14. I’m waiting for DEFRA to get back to me with a definition of the term ‘wild’ as used in the Act.
    Until we have such a definition we really don’t know what the Act permits or prohibits.

    Is a cat a wild animal?

    You know the arguments – ferrel versus domestic – but still generically a cat.

    How long must a mammal be in the domestic state to be outside the Act?
    How long must a ferrel cat be in a domestic environment to be outside the Act?
    How long must a domestic cat be wild to be protected by the Act?

    You see in the rush to legislate somebody forgot to get the scope and wording sorted – so now we have an Act that [apart from exemptions] prohibits the hunting of "wild mammals" with dogs.

    I use the cat example because everyone is familiar with both domestic and ferrel cats – but the same could apply to foxes because people do domesticate foxes.

    As the law stands at present a hunt could choose to raise ‘domesticated’ foxes – they could then release them into the wild for a period less than the period which would define them as ‘wild’ – the hunt can now chase and kill those foxes because they are not wild and not covered by the Act.

    I have no feelings either way – its just that I have read the Act and asked DEFRA for definitions – I first asked questions by e-mail in December 2004 – today I have e-mailed them again – if they don’t reply this time then I shall have to ask the questions of my local MP – Mr Foster 🙂

    Comment by Roger Huffadine — 17 Feb 2005 on 7:39 pm | Link
  15. Right now Britain is being flooded by immigrants. Many good people, many bad. Crime, and death in the streets. But all people can think to do is take away a hundreds year old tradition. Talk about cruelty. Look at the murder, rape and robbery. Also, these liberals who think fox hunting is cruel,well lokk at these cruelties. Have you ever seen the way cows are slaughtered, pigs, sheep, and chickens. When people come here from other countries do we take their traditions away? No. So why should Brits lose our traditions? Believe me. These rights infringements will not stop with the foxes. Ta

    Comment by Torr — 8 Mar 2005 on 7:29 am | Link
  16. when you have witnessed an ‘INNOCENT’ young fox have it’s skull crushed by the stomping feet of a cold blooded killer,you really have to ask yourself,’WHY’

    Comment by nadine — 31 Mar 2005 on 1:58 am | Link
  17. get a life all u townies hu think r way of life should be banned. it is not a sport it is not a game it is not cruel, its r way of killing the ill or old foxes we dont rip the foxes apart and make them have a painfull death. people hu want are life destroyed no notning about r lives and we need to look after r country side. listen all u townies we r not upper class snobs. u keep ur bullshit in westminster and we’l keep ours in the country side

    Comment by josh — 8 Apr 2005 on 2:09 pm | Link
  18. Grow up yourself, JOSH – "we need to look after the countryside" – by killing foxes?! Get real you dweeb. Too late anyway; it’s now law. There’s no chance of the Tories getting in and changing it back so you best get used to it. har har and all that, old boy…!

    Comment by PapaLazzzaru — 8 Apr 2005 on 6:14 pm | Link
  19. Why are the townies so pro fox, but at the site of a rat they demand that poison is put down which kills in a very painfull way. Just shows how little they want to know about to reality.

    Comment by Peter Fordham — 11 Apr 2005 on 3:36 pm | Link
  20. Although I haven’t heard any "townies" whingeing about rats personally, I do reckon there’s a bit of difference between a rat and a fox. I mean, who ever heard of foxes bringing bubonic plague into the country…?!

    Comment by PapaLazzzaru — 12 Apr 2005 on 12:57 pm | Link
  21. You may be living a few years in the past, bubonic plague no longer exists in the UK. It is simply that the British people have forgotten how to understand other peoples problems they think that the only important person is ME,ME,ME.

    Comment by Peter Fordham — 12 Apr 2005 on 4:13 pm | Link
  22. Disagree; firstly the comparison was a ridiculous one in the first place (ok we don’t have bubonic plague but then again we don’t go rat-hunting), and secondly people aren’t against foxhunting because of themselves – they are against it because it is cruel and inhumane to the poor animal on the receiving end. End of.

    Comment by PapaLazzzaru — 12 Apr 2005 on 4:23 pm | Link
  23. So it is OK to be cruel to animals that you choose not to like i.e. Rats but because you choose to believe that the Fox is a lovely fluffy animal it can get away with killing thousands of chickens, wild birds, lambs and anything else that takes its fancy. Not for food which is natural but just for fun. Please get your feet on the ground and put the cuddly toys away.

    Comment by Peter Fordham — 13 Apr 2005 on 3:47 pm | Link
  24. Come off it, there’s a world of difference between rats and foxes and well you know it. In the first place foxes don’t come and chew your skirting boards up; they don’t spread disease around human habitation; they don’t breed like rats, chew electrical wiring and so on and so forth. And I think it wrong to say "they kill for fun" – that’s a lame justification for killing ’em. They may kill through instinct but then so does man. But again, we (or I, whatever) don’t hunt rats; I don’t chase them with a pack of dogs while people have a good laugh and bring their children along to be "blooded"; if I DID need to "be cruel" to rats I certainly wouldn’t make it into a big social event. I would have no problem with the humane capture and putting down of a fox if it could be shown to be a problem – it’s the whole sport made out of fox hunting which is really sick.

    Comment by PapaLazzzaru — 13 Apr 2005 on 4:53 pm | Link
  25. It’s an odd one this foxhunting. I can’t understand why so many people get so emotive about it.
    I think we can all agree on a few things:
    Foxes are not ‘nice’ or ‘cuddly’, they are unpleasant scavengers which potentially spread disease and harm property.
    There is, therefore, a case for culls.
    The question is then how do we cull them?
    Or, to put it another way, must we impose restraints upon the methods of the cull?
    This must then raise the question what rights do "we" – the electorate – have over "them" – the hunters. An earlier post mentioned the fact that the majority of people want a ban. The funny thing is that this philosophy of majoritarian rule is not one that has been followed by Britain at any point in its democratic history.
    I’m sure that it’s not necessary to elaborate the dangers of majoritarian rule, and that just because most people want something doesn’t make it the right way to procede.
    I think it should be clear by now that there are more important issues than foxes at stake. By banning fox hunting we say that it is right for the majority to dictate to the minority how they should behave. In a global sense, the result is Iraq – America and her allies are bigger, therefore can do as they please. In a national sense, the result can be Rwanda- one group dissaproves of another and removes them of their ‘rights’ to life. These are exaggerated examples, but both current.
    The point is coming in Britain where we must choose to legislate either according to what is popular or according to a principle which dictates that rules are there as a framework to prevent society breaking down and that no group has the right to impose its will on any other group.
    There is no ‘right’ and ‘wrong’ to this, I personally favour a Liberal position of some sort, but I don’t resent those who chose the Communitarian, Majoritarian, Socialist or Conservative positions; provided they make a conscious choice and are aware of the implications.
    The danger at the moment is that many people are unwittingly majoritarian, to follow a philosophy unwittingly is to make oneself blind to its evils.
    A ban on foxhunting is about more than foxes, it is about those rules we decide should govern those laws that can be made. In an uncodified constitution we must be careful we know what these are. Is it right for ‘townies’ to dictate to ‘the countryside’ or vice versa; for "the people" to dictate to "toffs" or vice versa; for "whites" to dictate to "blacks" or vice versa… the list is endless. If we decide that it is, then good luck to us. If it becomes right by accident, then I’ll see you on the first plane, train or boat off this island.

    Comment by Freddie Yiend — 18 Apr 2005 on 2:45 pm | Link
  26. foxex kilin farm animals is a stupid excuse to kill foxes. there gona b eaten by humans any way. foxhunting is wrong and mean. rich people are bored with playing with their ponys and cars so they decide to go kill a fox

    Comment by chloe — 12 Jun 2005 on 1:22 pm | Link
  27. I can’t believe how insensitive people are to suffering. I once saw someone hit a fly with a newspaper. If you had seen the mess it made you would never want to kill a fly again.

    Chicken sandwiches are made from the misery of chickens stuck in spaces like shoe-boxes until they are killed for our convenience. I think we should concentrate on making life better for millions of chickens every year.

    A fox killed our kitten in the garden, but we shouldn’t blame it. I want to get another kitten and I don’t think we should try to stop the fox behaving naturally.

    I like the comment from the girl who wants to see people die if they don’t think the same way she does. It must be nice to be so dedicated to eradicating cruelty.

    Comment by quietimitation — 13 Jun 2005 on 10:13 pm | Link
  28. is it ok if my rabbits nail got ripped off is what i do

    Comment by hector — 5 Apr 2006 on 11:39 am | Link
  29. is it ok if my rabbits nail got ripped off is what i do

    Comment by hector — 5 Apr 2006 on 11:39 am | Link
  30. who gives a shit that its band ?? fox hunting is wrong and you are all SICK!! if this is the way you spend your time now wen ure older your gonna be a fuking twisted little cunt who kills humans for fun!!! is that what you want??/ no? good then stop NOW and think about what your doing you dumb fucks.

    Comment by v — 19 Apr 2006 on 3:07 pm | Link
  31. yes, because the millions of veteran fox hunters go around killing humans now don’t they. moron

    TALLY HO is what i say!

    Comment by henry — 7 Jul 2006 on 8:13 pm | Link
  32. yes, because the millions of veteran fox hunters go around killing humans now don’t they. moron

    TALLY HO is what i say!

    Comment by henry — 7 Jul 2006 on 8:14 pm | Link
  33. i think that hunting is a fantastic tradition never mind the ban.

    Comment by arthur age 12 — 13 Oct 2006 on 11:07 am | Link
  34. i think that hunting is a fantastic tradition never mind the ban.

    Comment by arthur age 12 — 13 Oct 2006 on 11:08 am | Link
  35. even though u all think foxhunting iz banned u can still hunt with a bird of prey. me n chloe have hunted all r life and its part of english tradition.we well always hunt and it not creul,if you went hunting you would all realise what it is about!so lets ALL FIGHT THE BAN

    Comment by chloe n phoebe — 22 Nov 2006 on 2:22 pm | Link
  36. Fox Hunting is wrong, I’d like to see all you toffs be chased yourself by foxes mounted on pigs with hoards of badgers by their side just waiting to get to soft inards. How would you like it if you had to run for 2 hours non stop only to realize that by the end of it, you will be torn to shreds by a group of frenzied dogs. Foxes aren’t ‘vermin’ as some people describe them, they are interesting and intelligent creatures. I’d like to say that we are in the twenty first century here, and fox hunting does not have a place in modern society, and it never will do, you bunch of blood lusting freaks!

    Comment by chutney — 5 Dec 2006 on 11:13 pm | Link
  37. Fox Hunting is wrong, I’d like to see all you toffs be chased yourself by foxes mounted on pigs with hoards of badgers by their side just waiting to get to soft inards. How would you like it if you had to run for 2 hours non stop only to realize that by the end of it, you will be torn to shreds by a group of frenzied dogs. Foxes aren’t ‘vermin’ as some people describe them, they are interesting and intelligent creatures. I’d like to say that we are in the twenty first century here, and fox hunting does not have a place in modern society, and it never will do, you bunch of blood lusting freaks!

    Comment by chutney — 5 Dec 2006 on 11:13 pm | Link
  38. I hunt and i’m not rich, so it has nothing to do with class. Also foxes are vermin, they kill animals for fun, which i have seen as i had 15 chickens and in 1hr a fox killed ALL of them and left every single body. So any one who says foxes kill for food, are wrong. More foxes are killed on roads and other ways such as shooting, which can lead to the fox just been seriously injured and left to die in a slow painful death, which in my view is much worse than been killed instantly by a hunt.Foxes are intelligent which makes them the animal they are, and teh reason they become a pest, they really clever ones get away, it like speeding up natural selection.

    Comment by Kat — 17 Jan 2007 on 7:28 pm | Link
  39. Fox hunting is a a sport that has been going for hundreds of years. For people who dont even fully understand fox hunting to try and ban it is completly un-reasonable.

    It is about survival of the fittest a young healthy fox isn’t going to get caught. Hunting doesn’t just keep the number of foxes down and help farmers it also helps to keep the population of foxes healthy because it is usually the old, injured or diseased foxes that get killed. People having to hunt applying by the rules is increasing the chances of young healthy vixen being shot because the animal isn’t getting a fair chance to run this increasing the population of diseased or injured foxes as they may still be hiding in the den.

    I come from a farming family and i have been hunting many times. My family also shoot pheasants, rabbits and other game, were will people draw the line there will end up being a law on all kind of hunting, shooting and fishing.

    The people who are wanting to ban fox hunting are the people who dont understand a dam thing that goes on. Just because you dont understand that is no reason to stop it. Also class has nothing to do with hunting. Many people view people who hunt as stuck up posh snobs which isnt true.

    How is it that the goverment and people against the ban are so worried about the welfare of a fox when there are hundreds of domestic animals suffering neglect or abuse every day. Surely it would be more sensible to put their time and energy into protecting animals that really need help not try and stop fox hunting. More fuss is being created about banning hunting than is really at all neccesarry.

    FIGHT THE BAN!!!!!!!!!!!! KEEP FIGHTING WE WILL WIN EVENTUALLY!!!!!!!!!!

    Comment by Georgie — 15 May 2007 on 10:30 am | Link

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